Dan S

Kool Lochlan, like I said, just idle musing.

Take a long, hard look at what you want to train in, what your goals are, and wh you would be training with. I don't know ow old you are, what kind of shape you're in, none of that, so I can't really give advice, all I can tell you is that if I had a nickel for every totally out-of-shape guy who came into my dojang wanting to "train mma", and crapped-out after one session, I'd be retired. Do you want to be a pro, or to fight at a semi-pro/club level in ANY of the sport-type disciplines? Boxing. wrestling, Judo, that ype of thing, or are you looking at it more from a self-defense angle? Makes a huge difference. With all respect to all artists everywhere, all fights DO go to the ground. You get hit hard enough, you fall down, you're on the ground. Usually being danced on. If you want, shoot me a PM and I'll be happy to look in your area for places that would match what you want to do. I first started training in Jiu-jitsu just about 50 years ago, so I've made the rounds and met a few people along the way.

Bout damn time, too! Looking for it, my man!!! @Lochlan, wondering, would it even things out if all the actual votes were cast the last week of the month? Don't know how this software works, but in other sites I've admin'ed, there is a poll option, and voting can be opened and closed at will. Just wondering if having ALL the work submitted get the same length of time to collect votes would work. No biggie, just musing.

Agree with both answers! I guess the "tone" that was disliked was my use of the phrase "fuck 'em". In that context, at least to me or those I know, it just means the same as "drive on", there is no hostility or animosity attacjed to it. The right thing to do is to go back to the original artist with your request, and take it from there. Over and out.

Hey March, welcome to LST! Hope you enjoy yourself here-there's certainly enough things to watch and read to keep you busy for awhile, and if your shopping for a tattooist, you couldn't have come to a better forum.

So, let's see, if the original artist doesn't want to work on it, the wearer of the tattoo should just say "sorry sir, may I have another"? No, he should, as I said originally, just go elsewhere. Probably by that point neither of them want anything to do with the other, so yeah, fuck it, walk it off. Again, the "consumer", as you put it, is wearing the tattoo. If he wants it changed, that's his prerogative. If the tattooist, after talking it over with the customer, doesn't want to change it, then it's his prerogative to tell him to fuck off. Pretty basic stuff. When you commission a piece of work, it's pretty much yours to do with as you choose. If I hire a carpenter to build a cabinet, and then decide in a year that I want it modified, why should the carpenter get all worked up about it? If he does, I would consider it to be unreasonable, and then, yeah, fuck 'em. A tattooist may work in a different medium, but a master carpenter is no less an artist...I've just never met one who felt he should pitch a fit whenever someone decided that their taste had changed.

No sense of "entitlement" involved. If he wants the tattoo altered or covered, and he's willing to pay for it, I feel that he owes the original artist-if it was a tattoo he was happy with originally - first shot at changing/covering it. I can fully understand if the tattooist chooses not to do so, were I a tattooist, I imagine I'd be less than enthusiastic about it, but, it belongs to the person wearing it, and if they want to change it, that's their right. As for the rest, if you don't like my tone, well, that's on you. I meant no disrespect to any tattooist working, simply pointed out that once the customer pays for the work, it's his to do with as he chooses. There is no entitlement or expectation of anything further being done for free, and if you'll read my post closely, you'll see that I specifically stated that I would expect to pay for any time and work involved in changing something. - - - Updated - - - Yeah, but c'mon, gotta liven things up sometimes!

The difference betwixt spending time and spending money. A person who works purely for art, well, when the art is finished, someone can look at it and say yeah, I like that, I'll buy it. If no one likes it, no one buys it, simple. A person who works for profit must need make their art into what the customer wishes. If I ask a tattooist to work up a special design for me, I expect to pay them for their time. If I change my mind, or don't like their rendering of my ideas, well, it's my money, right? If it isn't a question of safety, or a design reflecting poorly on the tattooist doing it, then I would say it's entirely up to the customer, and if the tattooist has a problem with it, they should just take their money elsewhere. Don't get me wrong, plenty of times I've gone into the shop with an idea, and had one of the guys there tell me, "look, this would really look better this way", and I've followed their advice and been glad of it. But I have to sympathize with someone getting a tattoo that they end-up not being completely happy with. My opinion is, give the original artist a shot at working with you to change/cover it to suit you, and if they don't want to work with you on it, fuck 'em, go on down the street. .02

I hear that...haven't been there sinnce 88 or so, and it was funky even back then!

Might be awhile-he just copped out to 9-11 years for the Feds. I'll see what old pix I can get.

No, #4 ain't into that, he's just naturally tripped! Anyhow, smoking dope is like a capital offense at our place...don't care if others do whatever they do, long as they don't bring it around us.

I dunno...I keep movin right smart when I gots to go thru the ROck! My people lived in Mountain Home for awhile, and I thought that was bad enuf, but then I went to LR...the worst of both worlds, hot, flat, boondox, and ghetto! Just shuckin ya, honest! I'm sure there are nice parts of town, I just never made it to 'em!!!

Wow. Little Rock...you have my sympathies! Anyhow, glad you founf the forum here, and hope you enjoy yourself, find plenty of good stuff to watch and read, and I look forward to seeing your posts and gallery! Welcome!

Good, solid flash is often timeless. Sailor Jerry, Cliff Raven, Spider Webb, Tatts Thomas, just to toss a few names out. I think there is a place for flash and for custom work, and often, they intersect nicely.

Maybe, but if you bomb a wall with something, it's graf, whether you call it art or whatever. IF you get paid to do it, then I suppose it moves into another territory, but it's still out in the public.

I got a full sleeve done around some existing pieces by Miles Maniaci when he was at CTC, maybe ten years ago. I walked in thinking I'd have Dale Grande do it, but he had stopped tattooing regularly and said "I've got thie amazing young guy working here now, and I think he'd go nuts on this". Excellent choice. Miles did a tracing of my arm, took the plates I brought in with the specific elements I wanted incorporatd in it, and called me back in a few weeks and asked me to come in and take a look. I did, and ended up having the wholepiece outlined that evening. Every two weeks we did another chunk, up to about six hours, until it was finished. He told me a flat rate-which was far less than anything being talked about here, but also was ten years ago. I apid it as we went, and made sure to leave a good tip at every session. Miles left CTC, went to Taylor Street Tattoo, and I heard from people trying to book work from him that he had a one-year waiting list. Wow. Now he works at Deluxe, and I never have heard anything but the highest praise for his work. Don't know if he's still booked out like that, cause I'm still hung-up on CTC. And that's a bitch! Shit, I had to wait two day to get Nick Colella to work on me once-it was turrible! I think way too much of what is going on now in parts of the tattoing world is celebrity/media driven, and that has resultied, IMHO, in inflated prices, long waits, and tattooers who are competent being billed as rock-stars. Of course, there are the genuine artists - tattooists - who are worth waiting for, but I think not that many. .02

I got rid of almost all my 78's, but did score a really nice quadraphonic amp/receiver combo recently. Number 4 son is going nuts on it.

Ummmmm...you're not, like, related to Ed Gein, are you?!

I bitch at my employees all the time about their tattoos, and tell them to cover them up! Hell...they're both my sons, and they've gotten so much beautiful work by Nick Colella that it's a shame to see them pull up in front of our office on their bikes with no shirts on and the sun beating on them.

Oh yeah-wax cylinders!

Very true. If you take a squint at some of the pix I posted from the old Easyriders Tattoo book, you'll see some real nice jailhouse...pretty easy to see the difference. It's a dead-issue, but to me a guy with webs or walls or any of the other tried-and-true prison work, all done outside and looking clean and shiny, is kinda like the hero of the tune "Pretty Fly (for a White guy)" by Offspring. Strictly my personal opinion.

Not to mention acetate and wax!!!

Welcom to LST, Bob. Hope you enjoy the site, and good luck on getting things back on-track with your tattooing!

Watup lil Paul, and welcome to LST. Looking forward to reading your posts and seeing your work-enjoy yer stay and have a good one!

As would I. Maybe the difference is that the records that belong to us are our vinyl, whereas a group of records that don't are vinyls. Who knows, maybe it's yet another permutation of the language...damn kids!