2012 American Presidential Debates - Denver

[CultExciter]

I'm a news junkie. I fully admit it. I had high expectations for this debate. I expected some "zingers." Didn't happen. I expected common sense to outweigh mere numbers thrown in the air. Didn't happen.

I don't think there was a clear winner in rhetoric in these debates. Romney supporters will see his superfluous flip and flop as support for the American people. Obama supporters will find his poise and "statistics" (and the fact that he isn't Romney) as the upper-hand.

Who do you think came out on top, and why?

And, for fact checking reference, please navigate over here:

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2012/oct/03/fact-checking-denver-presidential-debate/

[reverend1]

I thought Romney won the debate easily. I'm a business owner and a Libertarian so I am as far from an Obama fan as you can get.

[gougetheeyes]

@CultExciter I think my limit on news is about five minutes. It's nearly impossible to get any straight information from anyone and forget it when it comes to the debate. I've turned pretty sour at the whole thing.. "moderators" lobbing in easy questions that won't even get answered. That said, I was at work and didn't watch last night :D Two candidates just present the illusion of a choice, four years is not enough, make campaign financing illegal.

[David Flores]

The only place where I thought I could go to not talk politics. I am not opposed to it necessarily, I just assumed their was something implied that we just didn't talk about it, cause up to this point we haven't.

[gougetheeyes]

The only place where I thought I could go to not talk politics. I am not opposed to it necessarily, I just assumed their was something implied that we just didn't talk about it, cause up to this point we haven't.

I've stopped "subscribing" to certain old tattooers on FB because of their political rants.. I don't know about making it a hard-and-fast rule on LST about "no politics" but it's not a bad idea..?

[Mr. Smith]

I enjoy the relative peacefulness of this forum too much to weigh in too much. I'm a pretty avid political junkie too, although my lack of cable TV prevented me from catching last night's debate. If pressured to pick a label, I would consider myself a Social Democrat, so I was really hoping for Obama to pull out a strong win. From what I've read that didn't happen. The consensus from the sources that I've been reading this morning (who are certainly left-leaning) is that Romney won on style, while Obama won on substance, and that in all likelihood, neither did anything to sway the bases or make up the minds of any undecideds.

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That said, I also wouldn't hate a "let's all avoid politics" policy.

@gougetheeyes I've also had to unsubscribe from a few for similar reasons.

[Dan S]

The only solution is another revolution.

[Our Endless Days]

i hate romney, but i think he won. i was shocked with how well romney did in being articulate and sounding like he knew what he was talking about.

the douche bag was just tossing bullshit out of his ass to make himself sound great. obama kept calling him out on it, but romney did well in controlling the debate. he was stronging arming obama most of the time.

the scary thing to me is that people will listen to the bullshit that romney said and say "yeah. fuck obama. i don't want obama care telling me what treatments i need, or making me lose my insurance," which is clearly does not do, as obama specifically stated.

also, i find it fucking laughable that romney kept saying "i want to create jobs," but he made a point of mentioned that he will cut pbs if elected, as if pbs is some fucking evil, money sucking, blackhole, and consolidate government agencies.

i don't like either obama or romney, but obama is really the lesser of two evils. he has continued every horrible aspect of bush's foreign, defense (offensive) strategy, and surveillance, but has implemented some good domestic policies. however, romney wants to eliminate dodd-frank-as much as this act does, it still needs more added to it to curb wall street-he states he wants to get rid of obamacare, which is fucking the exact same thing as he created in Mass, has stated he'd want to curb women’s reproductive rights-while his running mate is a fucking nazi in this regard-and he also is vehemently against taxing the wealthy. Fuck this dude.

sorry for the long rant.

[David Flores]

It was only a matter of time, especially in an election year.

[reverend1]

I enjoy the relative peacefulness of this forum too much to weigh in too much. I'm a pretty avid political junkie too' date=' although my lack of cable TV prevented me from catching last night's debate. If pressured to pick a label, I would consider myself a Social Democrat, so I was really hoping for Obama to pull out a strong win. From what I've read that didn't happen. The consensus from the sources that I've been reading this morning (who are certainly left-leaning) is that Romney won on style, while Obama won on substance, and that in all likelihood, neither did anything to sway the bases or make up the minds of any undecideds.

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That said, I also wouldn't hate a "let's all avoid politics" policy.

@gougetheeyes I've also had to unsubscribe from a few for similar reasons.[/quote']

I'm up for the no politics rule. Those threads aren't generally go for a community.

[David Flores]

All the bull shit and my soft spots for liberal policies and civil rights aside, the biggest concern for me if Mitt Romney were elected would be his "tax cuts". I might get a slightly lower tax rate but not by much, but It has been implied that the mortgage interest tax write off is the first on the chopping block of "loopholes" to close. The only reason it makes sense for me financially to buy a house would be because the tax credits help make up the extra cost of owning and up keeping your own property. I don't think closing this incentive will help the housing market for buyers or sellers or the economy for that matter. But honestly I don't know if any of this is true because he won't talk about it. I guess I am not convinced that his tax cuts aren't really just going to benefit the rich.

[Brock Varty]

As a few stated...no politics seems like a good idea. Even the two most logical people can lose their shit when it comes to politics. Nobody ever admits they could be wrong and everyone feels like who they support is the best.

I do have a clear political preference and it closely follows my internal beliefs.

[Our Endless Days]

abortions for some, miniature american flags for others.

if you know what this is from, you're cool in my book.

[Lochlan]

I'm a fan of politics, talk them everyday, and they impact my work though we should probably stay away from politics as much as possible on this tattoo forum.

We have seen the most minor stuff set someone off and the forum moves from its purpose. Unfortunately this thread would probably end up getting heated, then the most traffic though people will say they hate drama, and tattoos will get neglected

[CultExciter]

Haha, you're probably right. I was more interested in the breakdown of the debates and the conversations that stem from human perception of win/loss.

I too have removed a few tattooers from FB.

I guess this is my overarching feeling then. I am not trying to pull in any Rodney King (RIP) "Why can't we all get along?" fustian. It seems we all wince at the idea of discussing because of the idea of community, and the disrupt it causes. People do tend to blow things out of proportion and reject the actual conversation. I like disagreeing. I like knowing how others feel, because it reminds me that I am my own person, and it's totally A-OK to not have the same views as anyone else.

Fuck it, I need to get tattooed.

[Lochlan]

@CultExciter

I firmly believe we need to disagree to move things forward though we need to disagree in a manner that is respectful and productive not stuck in a win/loss mentality. Or a my way or the highway pathology. Negotiation and the ability to have a difficult conversation are life skills that are very attractive. The ability to keep ones cool and sit in the uncomfortableness of difference knowing the other is not attacking you so calm your anxiety and realize we've all got lacks. No need to push your agenda but please do tell me about it.

Just my general thoughts

[CultExciter]

I couldn't agree more. Albeit, I was not able to phrase that feeling as eloquently as you.

[Dan S]

Politrix are okay to discuss, as long as everyone realizes that there are as many shades of opinion as there are shades of assh...er, color.

Obama is Obama. He is a Chicago politician, regardless of race. That, by definition, makes him a lying, cheating, backstabbing scumbag. Romney, being a professional politician, isn't much better.

To me, our choice is Obama or Obama-Lite.

The only solution is another revolution.

[slayer9019]

I also push for a no-politics rule. Judging what my facebook news feed looks like, I would rather not continue that trend here.

Plus who cares what they said, politicians are professional liars.

[Jack]

I believe in Harvey Dent

[Dan S]

AuH2O!!!

[eisen777]

I have too much hate for Mitt and while I dont like Obama much I will do anything to prevent Mitt from power. I wanted to vote 3rd party but my Mitt hate is so strong that Ill just vote obama to prevent him from getting into power. Then 4 years later ill hope the options are better.

[CultExciter]

@Lochlan, well, the good thing about all of this is at least we know the politics is a no go around here. Sorry to bring up a can of worms.

[Colored Guy]

I thought Romney won the debate easily. I'm a business owner and a Libertarian so I am as far from an Obama fan as you can get.

Romney easily held his own last night. For the small business, the trickle-down shit isn't working, it has to go the other way. He has to really pull some of the key states to pull it off next month. I don't think we can stand another 4 years of the stuffed suit, unless the world ends in December, I'm packed and ready to go.

Rob

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AuH2O!!!

I'm one of the few who remembers that, lol.

Rob

[Dan S]

I'm one of the few who remembers that, lol.Rob

Wondered if I was the only dinosaur!

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Actually, I hate both of them, but it makes no difference who wins or loses, the real power isn't in the President, and the partei's are just two sides of the same coin.

The ONLY way to get this Nation back to it's original state of being by the people, for the people, is to topple the two-partei system and replace the corrupt federal oligarchy with the Constitutional Republic that was founded and intended by our forefather.

Abortion, immigration, hoplophobia, race, these are all just social-constructs used by the Mandarin class to keep the serfs divided and occupied.

"And what country can preserve it's liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

Thomas Jefferson, writing to William Stevens Smith in 1787.

And just as true today.